Episode 3 Transcript
[00:00:00] John Kiker: So today we’re honored to be joined by my colleague, Katrice Hardy, the executive editor of the Dallas Morning News Media Giant Sister Company. Katrice is a Pulitzer Prize winning editor, a strategic leader, and innovator who loves producing hard hitting journalism that impacts the communities we live in and that we care about.
[00:00:20] As executive editor, Katrice carries the banner of continuing the legacy of award winning journalism at the Morning News, where she’s put an emphasis on finding and sharing stories that represent the challenges and opportunities with all communities across North Texas. Prior to joining the Morning News, Katrice served as executive editor of the Indy Star, the executive editor of the Greenville News in South Carolina, and was also managing editor of the Virginian Pilot.
[00:00:44] She’s also a proud graduate of Louisiana State University, and yeah, go Tigers, and she is also an unapologetic Saints fan. Anybody who was in this building after the Saints whipped the Cowboys could attest to the level of her fandom. So [00:01:00] anyway, with all that, we are so excited to have you here today.
[00:01:02] Thanks for joining us, Katrice. Absolutely. Thank you so much for
[00:01:05] Katrice Hardy: having me. Yeah,
[00:01:05] John Kiker: this is exciting. So you and I have been talking about storytelling quite a bit over the past few months. We always like to start off these episodes by asking our guests to tell their story. So what would you like the audience to know about your personal story?
[00:01:16] Katrice Hardy: So beyond the highlights of LSU and the Saints. There you go. There
[00:01:19] John Kiker: you go.
[00:01:19] Katrice Hardy: I, I think, you know, for me, the thing that I would like to relay to everyone is that, um, I grew up in Baton Rouge, Louisiana, um, with two hardworking parents who always instilled in me really to be the best that I could be at whatever that was.
[00:01:32] Now, they probably wanted me to go into the medical profession and they told me that, but I was truly drawn to journalism because I just did not see stories in my community of people who look like me reflected on television, unless, frankly, it was. A news about crime or something negative, and so, um, and I’ll date myself here, but I remember when Dan Rather would end his newscast by zooming in on some community in some part of the country that most of us had never heard of, and it would be a positive [00:02:00] story about somebody, some local hero, quietly impacting and serving others, and that was the reason I went into journalism.
[00:02:07] John Kiker: Wow. So once you got into journalism, what was it that kept you there? Like, what was the hook? Because, you know, hopefully everybody in their career at some point sort of has that epiphany. So it’s like, okay, this is how I can contribute back to, to tell those stories. What was, what was your first experience when you actually got into the field where you’re like, Oh my gosh, I could really make a difference here.
[00:02:27] Katrice Hardy: First, I mean, I remember being extremely afraid because I realized, you know, the power of the word. It’s so incredible, especially in print, and it can really help someone, but it can also really hurt someone in our community. And so I think the thing that kept me with it was the impact that the journalism was having on the communities that I lived in and that I covered and that I served.
[00:02:49] One thing that I think people forget is that We as journalists live in those communities ourselves. Right. So we want to do work that helps our communities be stronger. Um, and that helps us become [00:03:00] the best in the country at whatever that issue we might highlight is. And so I think that’s what drew me to journalism and has kept me into journalism because in a way, you know, the impact you can have with the work every single day can have such widespread impacts on other communities and even future generations.
[00:03:17] John Kiker: Absolutely. So Let’s talk about, um, your time at the Morning News and the, you guys, the, the, the paper, obviously there are, uh, breaking news events that you guys are obligated to cover, but I think the real magic for what your team has been able to accomplish has really been finding the stories that maybe people don’t know about or maybe have topic, you know, very, very topical knowledge of, but what it’s been wrought to life that’s really had an impact.
[00:03:40] Give me one or two examples of the stories that you guys have worked on that you’re most proud of.
[00:03:43] Katrice Hardy: I think, um, there’s so many, um, we’ve just got a wonderful staff of talented journalists. I think the ones that come to mind or are the stories we’ve done mostly that people were surprised by. So last year we spent 30 days on a project called Deadly Fake.
[00:03:57] And that really was helping the [00:04:00] community see how fentanyl is killing so many lives of people who frankly didn’t even know that they were taking fentanyl or the things that they took. We’re using did had fentanyl in it. Um, and we told that story really innovatively. It wasn’t just about the science It wasn’t just about what happens in court It was really about how people live their lives every day and have been harmed by it We’re shocked to learn that a loved one actually Um, had fell victim to fentanyl.
[00:04:27] And so those 30 days, there were stories of such heartache and also some stories of actually positive hope. And that was the whole idea. We had so many institutions here allow us inside of their doors. I mean, we got inside of Parkland. Um, we rode with DEA agents. I mean, we got access because people in our community care and they wanted the word and the message to be out to help warn their children and others about this.
[00:04:51] Horrible, horrible drug. So that’s one I’m really, really proud of.
[00:04:55] John Kiker: Well, and what’s interesting about that is, you know, as, as a journalist, you, you feel obligated to try [00:05:00] and cover both sides of a story. But in this case, it’s like there were 10 sides of a story.
[00:05:04] Katrice Hardy: Absolutely. No question. And even, you know, some of those pieces were literally first person pieces from people who either, um, are counseling folks with, fentanyl or actually from a fentanyl user.
[00:05:16] I mean, this woman who knows it could kill her and has tried to get off of it. Um, and can’t. And she told her story in such a raw, um, and emotional way. I think another story that I, um, I’m really proud that we spent some time on last year is a project called Bleeding Out. And it was a really look at something that I had never even heard of, but More people earlier in their lives before the age of 50 die from trauma, so car accidents and things like that than any other disease.
[00:05:44] But the, the, the issue with that is if there was easier access to blood like on ER trucks, many of those people’s Would not have died tragically. And so that whole project was about how we could potentially change laws and improve the system [00:06:00] so that we could have blood on ER trucks to better serve people quicker after these serious injuries.
[00:06:05] And so it was. Again, another remarkable award winning project that a reporter learned about, started really just kind of doing some work into it and reporting on it. And it bore also, you know, a week long project that we’re really, really proud of. And we’re actually seeing Dallas is now exploring a pilot program to put blood on its trucks.
[00:06:25] Again, impact.
[00:06:26] John Kiker: Well, it’s, it’s amazing because those are the kinds of stories of things that people just take for granted and assume. You know, if you’re, if you, if you’ve been injured and you’re in need of a, of a transfusion that it’s just going to be readily available and it’s not.
[00:06:37] Katrice Hardy: No, absolutely not. Um, I think the third one I would love to mention is our work on just, um, looking at the tolls here.
[00:06:44] Um, everywhere we drive, everywhere we live, there are tolls in our community. My monthly statement says exactly that. Yes. And it’s not, it’s not cheap, although, but for some of us, that’s kind of the only way we can get where we need to in a timely fashion. Yeah. And so the project really explored why the state has so many [00:07:00] tolls, how it has to.
[00:07:01] Some of the most mileage of tolls outside of, um, the country, um, outside of Florida. Um, and, and basically why the cost of them have just gotten so astronomical. Why? Honestly, while most people might not want more tolls, it might be the only way that we can start our community in the future with all the growth here.
[00:07:18] And so that that project called told Trap kicked off earlier this year, and there’ll be a few more pieces that are coming from that. But you do have lawmakers now looking at And seeing if they can be some reform efforts around helping those of us who have to drive them every day.
[00:07:32] John Kiker: Another great story.
[00:07:34] So let’s get into, like a little bit more of the gritty details of like, from your perspective as an editor, what makes for a great story, like when you’re looking at different pitches that your team is going out and finding in there, bringing you, like, what are the things that you’re looking for that draw you in to like push forward and flesh that out and see where it goes.
[00:07:50] Katrice Hardy: I think how it’s going to impact the lives of our community. So we look for, um, Stories that bring emotion, that help people want to actually take [00:08:00] action. That’s always the top of our list. We look for stories, frankly, that are going to make people proud to live here. Um, so in the past year, we’ve created a new, um, Heppel, she covers high profile stories.
[00:08:12] John Kiker: Love the piece about the Fletcher’s family over the weekend. Yeah. It was awesome. This is
[00:08:17] Katrice Hardy: writing about, like, people, people who are doing really remarkable, like, fun, enlightening things, but also people who have huge handback in our community that you might not have known about. Um, kind of the story behind the story that’s fascinating.
[00:08:30] And so, I think, you know, anything that is making people smile, cry, again, drive somewhere, give money, um, that’s what we look for. I
[00:08:40] John Kiker: think it’s, it’s, it’s funny because in a sense, What a journalist does and what somebody in the advertising business does are very different because we have clients paying us to drive a specific result.
[00:08:49] Right. But you guys are also looking for an outcome or an action, whether it’s to care about an issue, to, um, maybe write your congressman or, you know, ask your, ask your city council, you [00:09:00] know, uh, why there are so many potholes or why certain neighborhoods are unneglected or those kinds of things. So like in the end, stories are meant to drive action, whether it’s us on the advertising side.
[00:09:09] Are you guys on the journalism side?
[00:09:11] Katrice Hardy: Absolutely. I mean, something like you don’t have time to look at the proposed budget for your city next year, but that’s our job for you. And so you might not have known, for instance, recently wrote about a library that was about to be closed or was proposed to be closed as part of a city budget.
[00:09:24] And you know, those stories led so many people to go out and talk to their representatives about it and now it might stay open. But again, you might not have known that without journalists actually reviewing and analyzing that budget to tell you that story. Yeah. Absolutely.
[00:09:38] John Kiker: So, what’s interesting about your background as a journalist is that you also spend a lot of time on the digital journalism side and developing that and, you know, uh, I think one of the, one of the challenges that, that, that all media companies, um, now have are, you know, we have this amazing history of a great print product, but we also have a website and we have, and we, we think about the, the, the e paper, but [00:10:00] Storytelling can and should happen across a variety of formats.
[00:10:03] So when you guys are thinking about not just the story itself, but how to tell it, how does that come into play for you guys?
[00:10:08] Katrice Hardy: Oh, we think about storytelling as it is. It’s, you know, it’s multifaceted, right? Yeah. And so is there a video opportunity? ’cause there should be,
[00:10:16] John Kiker: right?
[00:10:16] Katrice Hardy: Um, potentially. Is there audio opportunity?
[00:10:18] I know, I know people know. We also have podcasts, you know, lots of podcasts, zoo. We sure do. Yes. Yeah. Eat, drink. DFW is one of our most popular. Yes,
[00:10:25] John Kiker: yes. Um,
[00:10:25] Katrice Hardy: we think about. Um, graphics, you know, how can we help you process this information in a way that’s easy? Uh, we think about maps. We want to show, not just tell you where about something, but show you where it is.
[00:10:38] Um, and then we think about, you know, how can we get this information in front of you? Not just as you mentioned in print, but. You know, on social media, you know, our stories live there, um, you know, on YouTube, our videos live there in our newsletters, you know, which stories today do we want to bring to you in newsletter format so that you can maybe pay a little attention with them.
[00:10:57] And we also do something called push alerts where if there’s [00:11:00] major breaking news or something we think that you might want to know more, more immediately. That’s a way to send a push alert to your computer, to your phone. Um, so that you can then read that story that way. And so for us, all those platforms help us really understand the patterns that our audience, um, has with our content, but more importantly, what they want to read and what they are reading.
[00:11:21] John Kiker: So your comment around graphics is really interesting because. I’ll use an analogy and you know, all of us have sat through untold numbers or presentations of power points that just sucked and they didn’t tell a good story and they’re full of words and numbers. You’re like, Oh my God, what am I looking at?
[00:11:36] But I’m here. I guess I’m going to have to understand it. But when you guys are using graphics to tell stories like you have to figure out how do you, how do you tell communicate this point in a really compelling way, literally in a matter of seconds. Otherwise they’re not gonna pay attention to it.
[00:11:48] Otherwise they’re not gonna get it. Otherwise it’s not enhancing the story. Okay. In a way that it could. So how do you guys think about graphics or even some of the artists, uh, some of the illustrations that you guys also use?
[00:11:57] Katrice Hardy: I will tell you that’s because of the talent of the people who [00:12:00] work in the Dallas for the Dallas Morning News.
[00:12:01] I mean, we have some incredible artists. Um, one of, I mean, one of our, you know, most popular is Michael Hogue. Um, the way he can take some of the most complex pieces of information and distill them into something So, um, entertaining and informative is, is just truly impressive and amazing. And so that’s how we think about it.
[00:12:21] I mean, often I’ll tell you, we don’t even know what Michael’s going to come up with or how it could be so informative and entertaining, but he figures out a way to do it. Um, and from every project I mentioned to even like. He had this really cool idea about, you know, folks at, um, American Airlines, uh, the center, they actually get a lot of calls for about the airline.
[00:12:42] And so, um, he did this really cool, like, kind of, uh, piece, uh, artist piece of all the people who work at the American Airlines Center. As a part of that reporting, he learned this. And so then that led to another story about how the folks who take the calls of the American Airlines Center. They now have like a little pitch about, no, this isn’t the airline.
[00:12:59] [00:13:00] Um, and so anyway, his, his, his artwork also was reflective of that. And I also think, you know, we have another, um, graphic artist who is constantly just thinking, how can I distill this in a chart, in a bar? Um, and all the ways that might make it be an easy takeaway. And so while we might have that long involved piece about say the tolls, we’re also going to probably have a really short piece where it’s like.
[00:13:21] For things to know about the tolls through graphics. That’s all a way of kind of helping time starved readers process that information more easily.
[00:13:29] John Kiker: Well, and I also think, you know, again, you’re talking about different formats. So somebody might want to read that long piece, but there’s a way to chop it up digitally to where somebody’s just seeing that nugget, not graphic.
[00:13:37] Might tell the story that they want, or they might be more interested. They might click into that and it might get you to the whole article. So that’s, I think that’s where the magic of understanding how all the parts across the ecosystem connect.
[00:13:47] Katrice Hardy: Correct. And look, it’s all amazing. Storytelling might not be the traditional way.
[00:13:50] You know, when we, I mean, let’s face it, you and I only had books and print products, um, but all these, yeah, and I do too, but all of these other ways are [00:14:00] how all of us are consuming information differently now.
[00:14:02] John Kiker: Talk about storytelling in that, in that way and meeting people where they are. Because, you know, if we’re going to.
[00:14:07] You know, make sure that, uh, those who are younger than us continue to be interested in the news. I think just assuming that they want to consume it the way that you and I do is, is, is following. So how do you talk about meeting people where they are? In that way, in terms of how you tell those stories,
[00:14:22] Katrice Hardy: we think a lot about, you know, so I think about my, my, my child’s generation, my child is going to be 16, my daughter, uh, in, in February.
[00:14:30] And so I think about the way she consumes her news is largely through video. Um, and so we, so that’s part of kind of how we assess. Should this be a video? And frankly, I’ll say this to you. Most things should also have video with it. Um, and so we think about that. We also look at the pattern. So I mentioned we can see how long someone is reading a story.
[00:14:49] We could see what time that story is really, really popular in gaming steam. And so we might look at that story and say, Hey, we’ve got two ways of telling that story. Maybe that story right [00:15:00] now has a long traditional kind of. piece, but it also has a photo gallery, but it’s getting so much interest. Maybe we should go back in and also add a photo.
[00:15:09] And maybe that is something we should put in the newsletter today. And maybe that is something we can maybe pull out some of those graphics in a longer form and actually have a shorter story with those graphics. And if people want to read the longer story, they can refer back to it. So we’re constantly looking at that.
[00:15:22] We even look at the headlines. So a headline on a story. That you thought should have done really well, but we’re looking at going, people aren’t seeming to connect with it. So maybe we should tweak the headline a little bit and then sometimes that that helps the story also resonate better. So all the aspects of storytelling and platforms what we spend most of our time on every day.
[00:15:41] John Kiker: So this is a little Pushing down on that a little bit. This is a bit of an inside baseball question So like but let’s say that you guys are working towards and this is I guess where you have some flexibility too Because you’ve got typeset deadlines For print where a story has to go where it’s going to go, but after that, you guys could continue to tinker with it online and chop it up.
[00:15:57] So like, talk about that process of constant iteration. Is [00:16:00] that, you know, it’s, it’s, you say it’s happening constantly, but Sometimes you’re very time crunched. I’m just fascinated about how those decisions are made in real time.
[00:16:07] Katrice Hardy: So if you think about it, the one thing that the news industry in particular, you know, in particular newspapers have done well is print, right?
[00:16:13] So we know how to do print and print, frankly, for us, because we’re so fortunate to work for a company where we have our own printing. Um, press and printing department, and so we can have our much later deadlines. So really what we do during the day is really focus on digital storytelling. And the way we approach it is we want to be first.
[00:16:32] We want to be accurate. We want to have a sense of urgency, but we also want to give you stories that you can’t get anywhere else. And so throughout the day, if there’s a breaking story, and let’s face it, we have a ton of breaking stories, right? Let’s get something out there so people know what’s happening, but then let’s keep going back to it and updating it.
[00:16:49] Um, and then at a certain point, you’re absolutely right. There is a press print, uh, deadline. And so that might be, we’ll know that that story, the ultimate story that’s going to go in print has to be in there at 8 and [00:17:00] maybe, or 10 or 11. And so we’ll finish it up, move it over, but then we’re still working on that.
[00:17:05] You know, we have people who work late, they come in really early. We’re still updating that or often writing additional stories to go with that. I think.
[00:17:12] John Kiker: Is that that’s probably a space to where you can sort of extend that story out so you see maybe an initial breaking news alert and then it shows up in print and then the journalist might continue to tell that story the next day with iteration.
[00:17:23] So it’s a it’s an opportunity to elongate a story or continue the story or maybe pivot a story depending on what information comes in. So that I think that’s the unique opportunity and the set of tools that you guys have at your disposal.
[00:17:36] Katrice Hardy: Absolutely. You know, and we’ve had, I’ll take this one example of, um, You know, the unfortunate, I mean, the tragedy of the Allen mall shooting.
[00:17:42] I mean, you know, pretty quickly there was what is happening. What do we know? Um, there was a, you know, stories from people at the scene. There was then the stories about, you know, who was harmed stories about potential, um, folks that the police were talking to stories about security. That story [00:18:00] lived on for weeks and months after, even a year after we went back to see how.
[00:18:04] Some of those store owners were doing and so with this constant iterations of those stories love it.
[00:18:10] John Kiker: Okay So as we look across the the journalistic landscape, what stories do you think we have in overabundance?
[00:18:16] Katrice Hardy: That’s a great question Uh, probably crime stories across the industry and i’ll tell you and it’s when I say crime.
[00:18:22] It’s more Um this happened that happened this happened Where we don’t have an overabundance. Almost like a police report. Correct. Right. What we don’t have an overabundance of, to me, is how safe is the community truly, who, what programs are really working? So kind of digging behind those facts, you know, one thing I’m incredibly proud of is this year we put a lot of focus on, um, writing about every victim of homicide in Dallas this year.
[00:18:47] Um, and the reason is because we write these stories and say, you know, so and so died, um, and the police are investigating. But we never check back in on who these people are and what they meant to their [00:19:00] families and to the community. And some of the stories we’ve written, um, for this project, I mean, you just, it’s, it’s just, it’s a tragedy of how, in some cases, how these people have died and what, and who and what they’ve left behind.
[00:19:12] Part of that reporting led us to realize that we had something like 25 teenagers that have been killed as a part of this project. Homicide. Um, uh, homicides this year. We would not have known that had we not started to uncover, you know, these stories and write about everyone. They’re not just numbers, right?
[00:19:26] Correct. They’re yeah, absolutely key people in our community.
[00:19:30] John Kiker: Yeah. And even if they, you know, well, and I think to dignify each one of them regardless of whatever, whatever they did in life, like they’re, they’re a human being. And there’s, I think bringing light to their stories is something you guys can do that nobody else can.
[00:19:44] Katrice Hardy: I agree. Um, and we’ve, we’ve really enjoyed being able to, um, Walk into the homes of family members who’ve opened their homes to us. Um, at some of the worst problem times in their life and tell us about their loved ones.
[00:19:56] John Kiker: That’s great. I love that. Um, so you [00:20:00] talked about that being an example of maybe what we don’t have enough of.
[00:20:02] What other stories are out there that we don’t see enough of that you know are there? I
[00:20:06] Katrice Hardy: think stories about, uh, you know, local heroes. Um, you know, we try really hard to, I mean, and part of our mission, our newsroom mission, is to also highlight the amazing people and programs, um, here. Things that really make North Texas special, um, but I think across our industry, no matter where you are, people want to see more and more of those.
[00:20:27] And so in the past year, you know, we’ve added a couple of beats. Um, as I mentioned, high profile is one. We now have kind of a, a features trending kind of celebrity reporter. So when Tom Brady comes here and eat at, eats at Albert A’s and all of our, one of our food writers told that story, we’re going to let you know that.
[00:20:44] John Kiker: Well, yeah, I think we were talking about it. You know, people, broccoli is good, but dessert’s not bad either.
[00:20:49] Katrice Hardy: Absolutely. People want to have
[00:20:50] John Kiker: fun. It’s all things in moderation. So when you think about great storytelling evolving over the next decade in the journalism space, like what are the biggest evolutions you see?[00:21:00]
[00:21:00] Katrice Hardy: Um, you know, I think AI is going to be a tremendous evolution. Now what that looks like, you know, I don’t know. But also if you think about how, again, we just had the print product and we would put it on the doorsteps and we assume that every step We put in print. People read. We had no way of tracking that on sharing.
[00:21:17] Um, we’ve evolved into having lots of information now, real time information on how people are consuming our news and what they’re reading. And so I think the next evolution is, you know, what are those platforms or those avenues to reach people in different ways? And frankly, how to reach younger people, um, who are really hungry for information, but they want to consume it very differently.
[00:21:39] John Kiker: Yeah, absolutely. So in the field of journalism, what gives you the most hope for the future? Because, you know, you, you see such a fractured world right now, um, people wanting to sit in their own echo chambers or really not go out and be willing to dispassionately examine an issue and, you know, looking for, sometimes they’re looking for [00:22:00] news outlets, um, or news outlets that are going to feed them things that they want to hear.
[00:22:05] So like, what makes you hopeful that we’re going to get to a better place to where you’re You know, the, uh, uh, the, the press can actually do the service that they originally intended to do, which is to inform the public in a meaningful way. What gives you hope?
[00:22:17] Katrice Hardy: I think every time we are able to, um, publish.
[00:22:22] You know, journalism with impact and then there is some impact, something that changes a law or, you know, sometimes we’ve written about a community in need and so many people in this community have stepped up and helps by delivering coats or dropping off money or food that gives me hope. And so the more we can tell those stories, we can remind people, here’s what the impact is.
[00:22:45] Um, of this work was to this person, to that community. Um, here’s how like this one person we featured, you know, got a hundred letters, um, saying thank you. You know, those things, I think that’s how we can set ourselves apart and how we can remind [00:23:00] people of the importance of local journalism.
[00:23:02] John Kiker: Love it.
[00:23:03] Patrice, this has been great. Thank you so much for joining me, my friend.
[00:23:05] Katrice Hardy: Thank you for having me. I really appreciate it. All
[00:23:08] John Kiker: right.
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